I've submitted what I consider one of my best pictures *ever*.
It is scoring at 4.3.
Two comments saying that this does not meet the challenge.
Can someone please define Zen to me then? I've read up on the subject so I at least have my idea of what it is. In my view I fully met the challenge and the picture is not bad (in fact one of the commenter says the picture is good, but does not meet the challenge).
Since I clearly did not understand the challenge, is it possible to withdraw the entry?
"You may request removal of your own photo, for any reason, if:
o - You make the request during the voting period. Requests made after the close of voting typically will not be considered.
o - There has been no rules violation and you have not been asked to submit proof on your entry. If you report a rules violation on your own entry or request removal after receiving a proof request, the request will be treated as a normal disqualification.
o - None of your last 25 submissions have been disqualified or removed. Remember that subsequent DQs within the next 25 submissions may incur a penalty as set forth below."
I actually thought mine was ribbon worthy adn when I saw it at a 6.12 this morning I hoped it would creep up but instead it fell like a rock and i'm at 5.4 now. voters are fickle. you just never know.
I feel your pain... Though my entry was shot last-minute, I thought it turned out halfway-decent. But alas, its current score sits at 5.15. Such is life... :(
There is a Taoist story of an old farmer who had worked his crops for many years. One day his horse ran away. Upon hearing the news, his neighbors came to visit.
"Such bad luck," they said sympathetically.
"We'll see," the farmer replied.
The next morning the horse returned, bringing with it three other wild horses.
"How wonderful," the neighbors exclaimed.
"We'll see," replied the old man.
The following day, his son tried to ride one of the untamed horses, was thrown, and broke his leg. The neighbors again came to offer their sympathy on his misfortune.
"We'll see," answered the farmer.
The day after, military officials came to the village to draft young men into the army. Seeing that the son's leg was broken, they passed him by. The neighbors congratulated the farmer on how well things had turned out.
"We'll see" said the farmer.
...................
Ergates: Sorry to hear you pulled the photo. In Zen terms you could have 'sat and not wobbled' and said to yourself.. 'we'll see'
I voted on all the pictures and I see similarities in a great deal of photo's. I think once voter's start looking at the entries and see a common thread; whether it MC or DNMC; that is what they look for throughout the rest of the votes. Too bad.....I have seen some wonderful pictures in the last few challenge's that show creativity and individuality, not counting mine (still learning), that received some low scores.
Personally, not gonna let it get me down and stop entering...how the hell am I going to improve if I don't fail. Just wish that these "voter's" would comment on why they gave a low score.
I think lots of entries are dealing with the DNMC question in this challenge, mine included. And I thought I "knew" what Zen photography should look like.
I think that Zen is as described in the challenge description, but that it is VERY open for interpretation. Some see it as an Asian-inspired image. Some see it as calm (like before a storm).
The way that I have voted has been in regard to how busy a photo is, in otherwords, if it draws my eye into many details, although they may be interesting, if it draws my eye away from a simple subject, or if there appears to be too much movement in a photo, I don't score it as highly as I may vote for another. It must have a calmness, a serenity, a simple-ness, almost a nothingness. If my eye is caught by significant detail, it disturbs the overall sense of simplicity and calm that I feel a zen shot should have.
Does that make any sense to anyone besides me?
Anyway, my own photo doesn't exactly meet these standards highly either, but it's doing better than all of my other entries so far, so I'm happy.
I think that Zen is as described in the challenge description, but that it is VERY open for interpretation. Some see it as an Asian-inspired image. Some see it as calm (like before a storm).
The way that I have voted has been in regard to how busy a photo is, in otherwords, if it draws my eye into many details, although they may be interesting, if it draws my eye away from a simple subject, or if there appears to be too much movement in a photo, I don't score it as highly as I may vote for another. It must have a calmness, a serenity, a simple-ness, almost a nothingness. If my eye is caught by significant detail, it disturbs the overall sense of simplicity and calm that I feel a zen shot should have.
Does that make any sense to anyone besides me?
Yes. That's how I thought I "knew" Zen photography, which leads me to wonder what the hell I was thinking when I took that photograph. :)
Despite all the shushing in the challenge description, many of these images are screaming their peace. The sound is like one hand clapping oneself on the back.
Zen is difficult to apply to everything. Looking at the zen entries, half the people think zen is just a good time to post an easy beautiful photo.
To understand zen, however, is the key. Zen is another branch of Mahayana Buddhism, and therefore, much more complex than just the "definition" that would be found on some internet site.
And that's the problem with the challenge. I am imagining 95% of all people voting, and who entered the challenge, have their own, and completely different ideas on what zen should be. So the voting will be wonky and a lot of people will say DNMC. Kind of like the Bokeh II challenge ;-)
But, as my old teacher once asked, "What is zen?", to which a lot of people had answers, to which he replied, "You are all wrong. Only Zen knows what it is", and hence, debating whether or not something is zen or not always ends in disagreement. Furthermore, if you understand the principles of Buddhism, it's easier to understand as well that one zen teacher will differ greatly from another, as they are all presumably at different levels in the goal of attaining enlightenment, abd thus will have varying amounts of knowledge.
Trying to figure out if a photo meets "Zen" requirements is impossible. All you can figure out is if the photo meets your requirements for what you think zen is. No matter what, though, you're wrong. Only zen knows if a photo meets the requirements. ;-)
[quote=zeuszen]
Ergates: Sorry to hear you pulled the photo. In Zen terms you could have 'sat and not wobbled' and said to yourself.. 'we'll see'
Thank you for the story, very enlightning and funny.
I just felt that entering a photo that I thought was among my very best in a challenge where it by everyone elses standard did not belong was counterproductive for me.
An entry which was falling like a stone (it was 4.2 by the time it got pulled) would have had me sitting and not wobbling, but crying inside ;)
Trying to figure out if a photo meets "Zen" requirements is impossible. All you can figure out is if the photo meets your requirements for what you think zen is. No matter what, though, you're wrong. Only zen knows if a photo meets the requirements. ;-)-Hideo
I think that Zen is as described in the challenge description, but that it is VERY open for interpretation...
The way that I have voted has been in regard to how busy a photo is, in otherwords, if it draws my eye into many details, although they may be interesting, if it draws my eye away from a simple subject, or if there appears to be too much movement in a photo, I don't score it as highly as I may vote for another. It must have a calmness, a serenity, a simple-ness, almost a nothingness. If my eye is caught by significant detail, it disturbs the overall sense of simplicity and calm that I feel a zen shot should have...
One purpose of (Zen-) meditation/practice is to calm the mind. The benefit of calming the mind is to clear it. A clear mind perceives more acutely than an agitated one: consciousness.
I agree that a busy image is unlikely to inspire a clear mind. Movement, however, may actually contribute something. I'm thinking of the man who holds on to a brittle root that grows on a cliff, prior to his fall to certain death, when he notices a single ripe strawberry growing next to it. Letting go of the root, he plucks it and explains: "Delicious!" I would love to see some movement in an image telling this or a similar story. Wind, too, is detectable via movement.
Significant detail can be, in my view, an equally difficult critical point. A mountain, a field of wheat or a patch of moss can reveal much of it, yet remain a perfectly simple subject. I can also easily conceive of numerous clinical subjects apparent in such an image, which when subordinated to one that affects them all, may combine very well and simply to the spirit of zen.
The serenity, simple-ness, nothingness you speak of, is, after all, a state of mind which, although paralleled by the physical world, need not be imitated and depicted in the photo, only evoked, stirred, yes?
